Australian bioethicist Julian Savulescu sits down with Dutch writer Bas Heijne to argue that parents already shape their children's lives in countless ways, so selecting genetic traits before birth is a difference of degree, not kind. The conversation moves through designer babies, the line between natural and artificial reproduction, and where parental responsibility ends and a child's own freedom begins. Savulescu, a professor of philosophy and bioethics at Melbourne with a specialty in genetics and reproductive ethics, pushes back on the instinct that engineering a child's traits is inherently wrong, while Heijne presses him on what gets lost if enhancement becomes routine. This excerpt comes from the first episode of the six-part Dutch series De Volmaakte Mens, in which Heijne travels to interview scientists and philosophers about what technology is doing to the definition of being human. No footage of clinics or patients here, just two people working through the argument on camera, one making the case, the other testing it.